how do you feel about this?? remember debates NO FIGHTING

[John]

I always liked Voyager (Star Trek), Captain Janeway often got into discussions regarding religion vs. scientific fact.

It was often very insightful despite the fact it was science fiction. I'd recommend checking it out. Something to study in Star Trek if you WANT to learn about religious ideals/philosophy, would be to check out the Klingon and Vulcan cultures. Very spiritual, and being that its Sci Fi, but based on real life, it fits into the commonalities of several tibetian monasteries (sp check), as well as several african cultures.

Check it.

[BNU-Judge]

And Please stop posting just for the sake of posting.

judge i dont see anyone who has done that yet except for this post i'm making right now. everyone who has said something has contributed.

My mistake, was referring to RD, if you take a look at his posts you'll see that he's making posts just to for the sake of posting, a lot more than contribute posts.

[Bnu-Sorceress]

he's made 2 posts since his original. once replying to mine, and once questioning science and "quoting" the bible. he's fine. leave him be. no more talk about it, lets get back on topic.

[Neltharius]

I'm Christian, but I subscribe to a very unorthodox school called Evolutionary Theism. Basically they believe since most Christians interpret Old Testament and many New Testament as symbolic literature, Genesis was symbolic as well. There's no reason why God creating humans can be a metaphor for God setting the evolutionary clock in motion.

[John]

That explains also, why every couple years, things get fucked up and then get fixed. It must be god winding the clock up. You'd think, being a deity and all, that he'd be able to create a digital clock and hardwire it so he didn't have to do anything.

If he can't setup the clock, he can call Geek Squad and we'll install it, for a nominal fee.. lol

[Anonymous]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

[John]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

I can't, but how do you know it even happened? :-P

[Anonymous]

because it was written down by the people who witnessed it. then it was formed into a bible that was written later on.

[John]

because it was written down by the people who witnessed it. then it was formed into a bible that was written later on.

Which is why I am not religious, because it was written down by man, according to that text in-itself, man can make mistakes.

I've always disputed the bible, because in reality, its just some paper with words on it. Its still considered fiction because there is not yet proof that everything in it happened. The ONLY thing thats scientifically proven, as far as I've studied anyway, is that at one point, there WAS a great flood. But it doesn't prove that Jesus, Noah, etc; existed.

Watching Dogma, actually got me interested in religion for a time, I was interested in quite a few churches, including jewish synagogues.
-- Censored by fanatacist --


fanatacist: John, don't use offensive language when referring to other people's beliefs... It's just rude and starts arguments.

[BNU-Judge]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

Simple, without straying off topic and creating a new debate. Science has not cought up with the awesome powers of Jesus, just because we (humans) don't understand something it doesn't mean its not possible or capable.

In the last 100 years mankind has learned a lot about not only ourselves, but also the world around us, just think what the next 100 years we'll learn.

[fanatacist]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

In my opinion, you can't. Because in my opinion, it never happened. Sure, there are people that wrote down that Jesus was resurrected. But are these not the same people that honestly believed in giants and dragons and the cyclops? Also, even today eye-witness reports are not always correct, even with our "modern" intelligence, media, and forms of recording information. I think that if 2000 years ago a person wrote down that aliens came to Earth and told them to believe in God, that book would be just as strong as the Bible now.

[BNU-Judge]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

In my opinion, you can't. Because in my opinion, it never happened. Sure, there are people that wrote down that Jesus was resurrected. But are these not the same people that honestly believed in giants and dragons and the cyclops? Also, even today eye-witness reports are not always correct, even with our "modern" intelligence, media, and forms of recording information. I think that if 2000 years ago a person wrote down that aliens came to Earth and told them to believe in God, that book would be just as strong as the Bible now.

Its not so much that what the bible says about Jesus existing and doing all that good stuff, but what also what the Jewish people at the time, recorded about him and his actions. For a person who is not messiah they recorded in writing about his death, dunno about all that good stuff he did, but if he didn't exist why would they record his death?

[Bnu-Sorceress]

how can you explain the resurrection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he resurrected, why cant we resurrect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

you can't explain it with science. thats the whole point. if it was science, it wouldn't be called religion. religion is not meant to be solved by science. it is based on faith and your own life experiences and actions.

Judge:
your comment sounded a bit sarcastic at first, but then i kind of got the feeling you were serious when you elaborated. however, i dont think science will ever "catch up" to the powers of Jesus.

just because we (humans) don't understand something it doesn't mean its not possible or capable.

Exactly.

RD:
You aren't going to be able to argue the reality of what's written in the Bible, it's just not going to work. the faith you need to have before even going in to the Bible is not present in john or fanat, meaning that they wont believe anything in it to begin with. its not worth arguing for that one.

[Anonymous]

because it was written down by the people who witnessed it. then it was formed into a bible that was written later on.

Which is why I am not religious, because it was written down by man, according to that text in-itself, man can make mistakes.
 .

Well Scientists write down their findings, how do you know that they aren't just making it up to say "Hey try this new pill i made, i promise you'll lose weight" yet they never work. hmm sounds like science to me.

(yeah the analogy sucks but its the only one i could think of at the moment.

and sorc im not trying to make them believe in the bible or specific stories written in the bible. im explaining why i believe in it and how i believe scientifical theory is wrong. this is a debate forum right?

[fanatacist]

Regardless, I believe that science can explain every single happening in the universe.

how can you explain the ressurection of Jesus with science? if it is truly science that he ressurected, why cant we ressurect our favorite dog that just died or friends that died sudden unexpected deaths?

In my opinion, you can't. Because in my opinion, it never happened. Sure, there are people that wrote down that Jesus was resurrected. But are these not the same people that honestly believed in giants and dragons and the cyclops? Also, even today eye-witness reports are not always correct, even with our "modern" intelligence, media, and forms of recording information. I think that if 2000 years ago a person wrote down that aliens came to Earth and told them to believe in God, that book would be just as strong as the Bible now.

Its not so much that what the bible says about Jesus existing and doing all that good stuff, but what also what the Jewish people at the time, recorded about him and his actions. For a person who is not messiah they recorded in writing about his death, dunno about all that good stuff he did, but if he didn't exist why would they record his death?

I'm not saying he isn't a real guy, that's certainly possible. But none of the things recorded of him doing seem possible to me via logic and science. Hence, even the recording of his life and death seem to lose credit by association. However, I do not deny the possibility of a guy named Jesus EXISTING at some point in time and being written about. I just think it was a tall tale.


To RD:

Don't take infomercials on OTC drugs to be science. In any case, the way it is different is that scientists do experiments to back up their work, working from the basics to higher degrees of complexity. Science can explain why the sun heats the earth, why everything in our galaxy rotates about a black hole, etc. through scientific induction based on principles we cannot deny, such as gravity. That is what science is to me: taking what we all know to be fact, and using it to explain things we do not know, or to discover new things that we do not have.


To Sorc:

Hey, don't be so closed minded. Find me physical evidence and I will believe :] But you're right, that's not faith; however, don'r say I don't have faith at all. Everyone has faith, but for some it lies outside of God and religion.